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 Scary episode at the SNF 
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Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 9:33 pm
Posts: 3316
Location: Vermont
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
Letting them know your concerns for the patients AND giving them suggestions are all good positive things Pat. Let's hope this doesn't happen again and the staff has learned something to prevent this or contain this in the future. Lynn

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Lynn, daughter of 89 year old dad dx with possiblity of LBD, CBD, PSP, FTD, ALS, Vascular Dementia, AD, etc., died Nov. 30, 2010 after living in ALF for 18 months.


Mon Mar 14, 2011 8:22 pm
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Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 3:07 pm
Posts: 1039
Location: Minnesota
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
There was a really sad death in a memory care unit here a few years ago. It involved a man in his 80s who had been a very popular professional wrestler in my youth. (He was cast as one of the good guys in that drama, and was also known for good works in his personal life.) He had Alzhiemer's. The other man, 97, had been a scientist (biochemist, I think), and was of slight stature. I think that he had AD too -- definitely some kind of dementia. He was a concentration camp survivor, if I'm remembering correctly, though I guess that doesn't have anything to do with this story, except add irony. For some reason the wrestler took a dislike to the older man. (I'm not sure if it was mutual.) And one day the wrestler slammed the scientist around and killed him.

Police investigated it as a homicide but the wrestler was not indicted because he was judged to not know what he was doing.

Sad, sad, sad.

Maybe the lesson here is for long term care facility staff to pay close attention to irrational animosities that develop between residents, whatever their diagnosis or background.

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Jeanne, 68 cared for husband Coy, 86. RBD for 30+ years; LDB since 2003, Coy at home, in early stage, until death in 2012


Mon Mar 14, 2011 9:44 pm
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Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2009 1:46 pm
Posts: 3213
Location: WA
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
What did they do with the wrestler, then?

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Pat [68] married to Derek [84] for 38 years; husband dx PDD/LBD 2005, probably began 2002 or earlier; late stage and in a SNF as of January 2011. Hospitalized 11/2/2013 and discharged to home Hospice. Passed away at home on 11/9/2013.


Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:46 am
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Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 3:07 pm
Posts: 1039
Location: Minnesota
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
I don't think that appeared in the papers. If it did, I missed it.

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Jeanne, 68 cared for husband Coy, 86. RBD for 30+ years; LDB since 2003, Coy at home, in early stage, until death in 2012


Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:53 am
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Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2010 5:46 pm
Posts: 610
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
Jeanne, at least in the states with which I am familiar, if someone is taken by the police and held for psychiatric reasons, it is under a special statute, the case is treated confidentially and it never makes the publicly-accessible court records, let alone the newspapers. So finding out anything through the public media is unlikely.

Julianne


Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:03 pm
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Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 3:07 pm
Posts: 1039
Location: Minnesota
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
That makes good sense to me. What made the papers was during the period it was being investigated as a homicide. I think the general reaction to it (that I heard) was to feel sorry for both men and to wonder if the facility could have done anything differently to prevent such confrontations.

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Jeanne, 68 cared for husband Coy, 86. RBD for 30+ years; LDB since 2003, Coy at home, in early stage, until death in 2012


Tue Mar 15, 2011 3:09 pm
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Joined: Tue Dec 29, 2009 2:28 pm
Posts: 464
Location: Minnesota
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
I remember the incident with V, Jeanne. I think there was talk about coming up with policies or regulations (at the state level) to try to prevent it from happening again, but I don't think anything came of it. Some residents at ST, where my mom is, can be so sweet at one minute and then something sets them off and they do a Jekyl and Hyde thing. Any number of the very good staff members go home with bruises when that happens. I suspect this makes the whole thing so very unpredictable. I have noticed that fear and a perceived need to protect themselves and their things often sets people off.

I remember the care facility this happened at and, if I'd had to consider them for mom's care, I'd have asked some very specific questions about how they are working to prevent it from happening again. And probably would have found some way to take further care of her at home just to avoid the place (which had, at one time, a very good reputation).

I wonder if the family has been asked to take him home where, hopefully, they could afford private nursing. I do remember that the victim's family was very forgiving.

Kate

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Kate [i](Cared for Mom for years before anyone else noticed the symptoms, but the last year of her life was rough and we needed to place her in an SNF, where she passed in February 2012)[/i]


Wed Mar 16, 2011 11:25 pm
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Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2011 11:28 pm
Posts: 13
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
When Mom was placed in her NH we were warned that the woman that she was rooming with was slightly territorial about the room that she was in. The staff said that they would monitor the situation closely. It later came to my attention that there had been a run in with the lady in the other bed. I was informed of this by my SIL after we had removed Mom from the NH due to her severe reaction to the resperital. We do know that Mom fell while at the NH due to the bruising on her back and side that we found at the hospital. The staff at the NH is not fessing up that they knew about a fall yet someone had to see the bruising when they dressed her. Anyway, we are going to give the NH one more chance because it is supposed to be one of the better facilities in our area but I have told the director that I want her moved to another room. When she returns to the NH we will be monitoring her as closely as possible.


Fri Mar 25, 2011 10:33 am
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Joined: Fri Jan 15, 2010 9:33 pm
Posts: 3316
Location: Vermont
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
I don't know about your state, but in MD, where my dad was, they were required by law to tell us of any falls, cuts, etc. For the first few months I was getting quite a few calls, but the calls started tapering off, and they mostly called when it was a "bad" fall - like he hit his head when he fell, for instance and they were required to take him to the ER for that. You may want to ask what the law is and what the protocol is, and if you want them to call you each time, even if it isn't law or protocol, that is your prerogative to do so. Do what you feel most comfortable with in the care of you mom. Lynn

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Lynn, daughter of 89 year old dad dx with possiblity of LBD, CBD, PSP, FTD, ALS, Vascular Dementia, AD, etc., died Nov. 30, 2010 after living in ALF for 18 months.


Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:57 pm
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Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2009 1:46 pm
Posts: 3213
Location: WA
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
Yes, in our state, too. Both times my husband has fallen in the SNF they have phoned me.

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Pat [68] married to Derek [84] for 38 years; husband dx PDD/LBD 2005, probably began 2002 or earlier; late stage and in a SNF as of January 2011. Hospitalized 11/2/2013 and discharged to home Hospice. Passed away at home on 11/9/2013.


Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:11 pm
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Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:59 pm
Posts: 1978
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
Even if the fall was not documented which it should have been law or not .
The bruising should have been documented for sure !

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Irene Selak


Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:59 pm
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Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2009 10:18 am
Posts: 276
Location: Washington State
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
Irene, so many times I have been called about a fall and they often say that they saw no bruises. The next day, the bruises are they when I check her over. In my experience bruises don't show right away. I ask that the ALF call me for all falls. When I get a call I ask for as much info as I can (where, when, whether she struck anything, etc.) and I thank them for calling. I don't place blame because I want them to tell me. Besides, it is the disease. My LO has fallen with all of her family and immediate CGs. One moment she is up, the other she is falling. Today she wanted to show her grandson how she could walk without the walker. I followed about 6 inches behind her and caught her as she was going down. I'm thinking that sinemet might help. Maybe I need to start a thread on sinemet.

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Annie, daughter of brave Marie, dx 2007 and in ALF


Fri Mar 25, 2011 10:58 pm
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Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2009 2:59 pm
Posts: 1978
Post Re: Scary episode at the SNF
Annie,
I agree bruising doesn't show up right away, I could bump into something today and maybe tomorrow I will feel a tenderness and sure enough there is a bruise my point in previous post to Agr was that they not only were not told about the incident but they found bruising on the Mom's back that is what should have been reported.

My Mom was in a ALF for a few yrs not with dementia but everything that happened they called to let me know but I too made that very clear from her admission so perhaps families need to be a bit more adamant from the beginning!

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Irene Selak


Sat Mar 26, 2011 10:49 am
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